Sunday, January 24, 2016

30K/40K: I Just Want To Play With My Toys

What do you mean I can't take (fill in the blank) when I play your 30K army?!  Do you realize you're taking a freaking PRIMARCH?!  Warning: yes, I am more than a bit indignant about this issue.


So I'm talking with a mate who is now immersed in playing with his shiny new 30K army.  I still cling to the archaic 40K version of the game.  However, I really fancy some of the Taghmata Mechanicus models, particularly the Thallax and the Vorax Runabouts.  They will be a nice addition to round out my Skitarii/Cult Mechanicus force.  But I mention I am bringing them to our next game, his eyes narrow, he looks at me, and with a straight face says..."You can't take those models, they're not allowed in 40K."  Exsqueeze me, baking powder...did you actually say the words "those aren't allowed in 40K?!"


Does he realize he is taking 20-model squads of Marines?  That they are armed with all kinds of fun and wacky 30K weapons?  That his terminators have a 4+ invul save?  Not to mention the fact that he is taking a primarch!  And yet I can't field half a dozen robots with Jetpacks and three bug-eyed servitor assasins?  This is freaking insane.  So people are willing to play their 40K friends with their 30K armies, yet I guess don't want us to corrupt 30K models by playing them in a 40K list?  This makes absolutely no sense to me.  We are not talking tournament play.  We are talking casual gaming between friends.  There is also the "you can't take that vehicle with Flare Shields."  Why the heck not?  I am looking at page 58 in my Crusade Army "red book." It shows that for 25pts I can add a Flare Shield upgrade.  Oh, I see, because it shows the same vehicle in your fancy 50 Quid Imperial Armour tome with no Flare Shields, your expensive version of the book trumps my working class version.


Are all 30K/40K players doing this elitist thing?  Of course not.  Another friend has no problem with me bringing a few 30K units, as long as I pay the proper cost and slot them in the appropriate place in a CAD.  So why the heart burn over adding some Forge World goodness to my 40K lists?  I just don't get it.  It just makes NO sense to me that if there are models available from multiple divisions of the same company, and that 30/40K both use the 7th Edition Ruleset as the core of their gameplay, that any model from any GW source cannot be used in casually gaming.  I get that in tournament play this would be a concern.  If it is a strictly 30K event, then all models should follow those guidelines.

Do people thing that 30/40K hybrid lists are somehow unbalanced/more powerful than pure 40K lists?  It is that they want the rules applied consistently?  If it's the former, that just doesn't bear itself out when you look at what people can bring to the table on both sides of the current meta.  30K armies are certainly more expensive model for model, both in terms of cost and points, but you certainly get what you pay for.  If it's the latter, then someone has an interesting sense of humor.  Do Forge World rules specifically state "the units in this book cannot be used as part of a list that otherwise consists of models not from the Horus Heresy model line?"  Even if it did, do 30K players actually feel threatened by a hybrid list?


Let's just be clear...if I play you in a casual game, I should be allowed to take any models from either GW or Forge World, as long as 1) I pay the appropriate points cost, 2) I slot my units into the appropriate position on an CAD (unless I am playing Unbound) and 3) I give you the courtesy of letting you know I am dropping Forge World models into my 40K list.  The latter being a part of the often mentioned "social contract," which on more than one occasion, I admit to being remiss in following.


Bottom line...if you are bringing a bloody primarch, then I sure as heck have every right to bring whatever I freaking want to the gaming table!  I just want to play with my toys!

Do you take "30K" models in your 40K lists?


  1. 100% agree.
    In my gaming group there is a Space Wolves 30k player that it's preparing a stormtalon and a scout land speeder to play with it (although they are not part of the 30k) just because he likes the looks of the models. Personally, I prefer that everything on the board is 30k just for the looks, but if he likes it, it's totally fine for me. After all, he's first a friend and second an opponent! Also, nowadays and rulewise, regular GW stuff tends to be much more insane than FW.
    Try to convince your mate to play a game, just one try, against your 40k with 30k units. He will realize it's not that bad (try not to table him at least xD).

  2. So do your Marines have ATSKNF? Or can your little robots ride in a Storm Raven? In my mind, the burden would be on you to show me that you're not including these units as a 'power-game' move, cherry picking the best version of a unit. Would it be so hard to make the rest of the list fit 30k?
    That said, you make it sound in this post like that is not necessarily the case. Also, I don't know much about HH rules, but I thought lots of the units (like the FW resin Knight Titans) had experimental rules for '40k' lists with some extra restrictions (can't have more 'archaic' Knights than 'modern', etc).
    Obviously I'm of two minds about it. Ultimately the BRB tells us how to build an army, and yes the 7th Detachment system lets you be VERY flexible, but you should still try to either follow the system as best you can or come to an agreement with your opponent about fielding an Unbound list. Clearly there is not an agreement here with the guy from the above example. So let's find out what you both would agree to.


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